Robbie Harper – Utilizing PR for Growth
In this inaugural eighth episode, Lee interviews Robbie Harper, a skilled PR professional who helps executives build personal brands. They discuss the role PR plays for the growth of a company and branding. Robbie brings a wealth of knowledge over his time working in PR and his perspective on not taking a one size fits all approach for businesses.
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Lee Murray (00:00):
Welcome back to the exploring growth podcast. I'm glad you're here today. I'm discussing PR strategy with Robbie Harper from blue bridge PR. Let's get into it.
Lee Murray (00:12):
I am excited to have Robbie Harper from blue bridge PR on today. , Robbie and I actually went to school together back in the late two thousands. I think we graduated about a year apart from each other. And then about 15 years later, our paths crossed again, when I walked into a local coffee shop back in his hometown and, the town that I moved back to, and since then we, you know, kind of rekindled our friendship and have we realized that a lot of the things that we do overlap. So we work with a lot of the same clients and, I've been able to see him work and him, me so I was excited to when I had a chance to bring him on, I can say that Robbie's a very skilled PR professional and, helping executives build their personal brands and working with companies as well, I've personally witnessed the work that he's done for his clients and the results that have come from it. And I can confidently say that he's got the chops. , so again, I was excited to bring him on and talk about how companies can use PR for growth. Welcome to the podcast. Robbie,
Robbie Harper (01:17):
Thanks, yeah, excited to be here and, yeah, I'm looking forward to some PR questions today.
Lee Murray (01:28):
Yeah, let's do it. , so, you know, let me also remind you, you know, we're talking about small to mid-size growing companies, CEOs, and their marketing teams. They're listening to this, and they're, you know, if they're listening to this episode, they're probably interested in have either done and failed at PR or haven't explored PR, so they're again, exploring that idea of like, what can PR do for our company, or maybe even a, a, an executive leaders' brand as they're trying to do more on LinkedIn or, you know, that kind of thing. So why don't you first give a, just a quick background on how you got into helping executives with personal branding. So that'll sort of set the stage, give them context to your ideas.
Robbie Harper (02:15):
Yeah, so just give a brief background on how I got started, when I first started wearing NPR, I worked for a, I, I would say a relatively, I would say a medi sized agency, small to medi, and they were, I would say 90% of their clients, or law firms. So more like corporate law firms, multiple offices, like tons of attorneys and, kind of my job was to help these attorneys get, media attention based upon their,
Robbie Harper (02:59):
kind of niche practices that they were doing. Like, you know, some, some were in cyber law somewhere in, you know, workers, compensation, law, just, you know, very, very niche and, targeted practices. And so the media attention that they needed needed to have that to, to basically position them as experts in those certain areas, so for instance, what, you know, someone that that's like cyber law, you know, I don't know, it's been probably seven or eight years ago. There were all of these, data breaches that were with, you know, target and PF chains and just all of these companies that had these data breaches. And so they were looking for somebody media once were looking for somebody to be able to speak to that. And so, so I pitched, you know, a few attorneys and, you know, basically just positioning them as experts in their areas.
Robbie Harper (04:03):
And so that's really where, you know, and since I've started my company I don't necessarily just work with attorneys. I work with a bunch of different types of industries, but, it's really, you know, everybody's an expert at something, you know, and, and it's really nine times outta 10, there's a business owner who, they're confident enough to be able to address content based upon what it is that their, focus is. And so that's really where PR and the personal branding, kind of overlap. I mean, they don't necessarily overlap, but they compliment each other, these PR you know, especially media relations, which is the PR that I focus on is, it's, it's just media attention. It's just, you know, there's other aspects of PR, but true media relations, it's, you know, interviews with reporters and byline articles that somebody can write. And so getting that in front of their right audience, who will just elevate their business and their personal brand.
Lee Murray (05:23):
Sure, sure. Yeah, you know, like I said, I've seen a lot of the work you've done and, and, you know, the outcome of that work is kind of broad, you know, I've seen where, you know, I know you've shared with me some of your client, results of kind of, kind of broadly that people have been able to build their business on the back of getting noticed in certain trade publications or, you know, specifically, or, or broader publications, and then of course it, it also has provided a leverage point for them to, to leverage and sign of some of the other marketing efforts they're doing too. I'm, I'm curious what you think the current role is that PR plays in the growth of a company right now.
Robbie Harper (06:13):
I think it, it plays a part, it plays a part, however much somebody wants it to play a part, I mean, it it's really what you want to get out of it and you can, you can utilize it at any time during business. I mean, even if, if you're a, if you're a solo entrepreneur, you can use PR , you know, you can, you can write articles, you can write guest blog posts, you can be on podcasts, such as this, you can, there's so many things that you can do to position yourself as an expert, I mean, you know, you've, you've had other guests and we will continue to have more guests who they're they'll, they may not be a PR expert, but it may be, you know, banking or whatever. And, I mean, at any given point, the, it just, the main thing about it, where it intersects with personal branding is that it builds trust.
Robbie Harper (07:16):
It it's the factor that, the trust factor that is so important that if somebody talks to Lee Murray and he's been in marketing publication or has a podcast, or, you know, has written articles for something else, then there's a little bit of that, trust element that comes up in their mind and in their perception of who you are. So it, it can help anybody at any given time and, you know, and it's something that people can do on their own. I mean, it's, it, there's a, there's a bit, bit of a learning curve to it, to, to do it really well where, you know, somebody like my business can, can really target in on that. But, I, I think that, you know, there, there are definitely things that you can do now that, you know, and that you can implement and it just builds moment from there.
Robbie Harper (08:19):
Its not, I always say to my clients that, that I start out with one placement isn't gonna necessarily make, make you an overnight success, there's a lot of other elements that go into it, but it's the recurring, the recurring thing out there that, you know, somebody is in the Orlando business journal or the wall street journal, or even the local newspaper over and over again, it's that repetition that builds the, perception in someone's mind that yeah, they are, are an expert. Like they, they know what they're talking about. These reporters are talking to them for a reason. And, you can do that at any time, any, any, any time in any, true any level of business, no matter if you're starting out or you're, you know, you're the CEO of a fortune 500 company.
Lee Murray (09:17):
Yeah. You know, the way I think of PR is in kind of two ways, one is amplification of what you're currently doing, at whatever level, and then a leverage point for what you wanna do, so I have a colleague, the, you know, the experience, another experience I've had outside of working with you is, I got a colleague that I, worked closely with, or, you know, stayed in touch with. And he has, he hired someone to handle his PR for him exclusively, cuz he saw it. It was a, it was a priority for him, right. To build his personal brand. And over the last, I don't know, couple years, again, back to the repetition, point he has added a lot of logos or, you know, business magazines, marketing magazines, different industry specific, publications to his, credibility, that he now has on LinkedIn, on his website and other places.
Lee Murray (10:15):
And what's so cool that I've seen happen is, now that he has that credibility or the trust that you're talking about, that that's built immediately when someone doesn't know you and then they see that, oh, you know, you have all this stuff that obviously these people thought highly enough of you to consider your thoughts, credible. They can come out of nowhere and see you. And of course it can't just be that it's gotta be, you know, like you said, a lot of other factors that play in, but they can see you and, and build trust quickly, so the, like the velocity in which you can build trust with a buyer is exponential when you have, sort of this backlog of, public relation type of work in the, in the mix. And, and just to bring it around to like, you know, to insert it into more, a bigger marketing strategy now that you have that you can leverage it so you can drive people to a conversion point, right?
Lee Murray (11:16):
So like a lot of things that I'll help my clients with is helping them think through what their buyers really are, the needs they're trying to solve, like the problems they have and creating these conversion points, you know, call it a workshop webinar, you know, some type of an event, that you're driving towards. And if someone comes out of the blue and they haven't been following you, right, but now they kind of peek their head into your ecosystem of the content you've created. And they see all this stuff that you've done from a PR standpoint, the velocity to which they are con convert is much higher than, than if they have to have a big question work in their mind as well. They, they posted this article or they posted this blog post and that was pretty insightful. And, you know, they seem pretty intelligent on LinkedIn and, you know, I like the way their website looks, you know, but they have this third party credibility there immediately that that factor of trust is built and now they could be a conversion point at that event, which I think is amazing.
Robbie Harper (12:27):
Definitely. Yeah. I mean, yeah, the trust factor, you know, if you come across somebody that that's written a book, you know, that automatically like elevates somebody in other's minds, and with, with PR I mean, it doesn't have to be a book, I mean that's a huge thing, but just under that, I mean, if you were regularly getting media attention, yeah. You're, you know, in the, it's funny in the marketing funnel where, you know, a lot of people think PR is just general awareness, which it can be, but further down in that funnel, you know, when somebody sees it, if they see you for the first time it's going to, like you said, build, it's got that trust, but it's going to move them one step closer to buying or, or utilizing your service or whatever that may be.
Robbie Harper (13:30):
, it just, it just, it, it, it just moves them further down the funnel, so yeah, absolutely. , I mean, that's one thing, and then the other, the other benefit is that you know, among your, your current network, you know, your network of LinkedIn followers, your, you know, Twitter or, or email followers, that kind of thing. When they start seeing you in the media more and more frequently, they're going to be a megaphone for, the people they're connected with because they not only do they already follow you and they trust you to a certain extent, but when they see that you, have media placements in credible places, then it's just gonna magnify and they're going to kind of naturally and more of a grassroots type thing, you'll get more followers and, and possibly more customers.
Lee Murray (14:30):
Yeah. You know, it's interesting that's an interesting way to approach it because, you know, what you're saying is that your social presence and engagement can underscore anything you do with PR and vice versa. So, you know, you're really building, as I like to think about it, like an ecosystem of content that people can participate in, and observe, mm-hmm <affirmative>, and, and I, I think that's, I think that's kind of, it's good to think about, like, you know, what results are you gonna get from PR? Well, I mean, you're, you're, you're, you're probably gonna get more results than you may have thought traditionally, but it's what PR is gonna do for you in the ecosystem of everything else you're doing. It's not a singular siloed type of thing, so I'm, I'm interested too, you know, cuz we've talked a lot about this, like you've worked with companies, and , you've, you've done a lot of PR work with executives and, and for company brands, what have you seen, that's worked like to actually, you know, add growth to a company, you know, specifically related to PR
Robbie Harper (15:45):
well, one thing that works, as far as an approach, a lot of people think that PR is just, you know, sending out press releases in a shotgun approach, you know, which that, that does have some merit, and, and has its own place. I, I think with, you know, people that pick up press releases from like an SEO perspective, but really where, really where it works with, my clients has been targeted, targeted media pitches to where, somebody, somebody that is the CEO of a construction company, architecture and construction company, for example, you know, doing, putting out, you know, kind of a press release, announcing something that's newsworthy of a new, their newest client or that kind of thing. Sometimes that helps, but more importantly, like what is it that they can speak to, to their industry or their audience, and, and how, you know, and targeting those outlets and those writers and those influencers that can amplify that message.
Robbie Harper (17:12):
And so a lot of times what I do I mean, it's just a simple email to somebody that, is a good match and would cover that person or, you know, listen to what they have to say and just saying, you know, introducing them to somebody in the media, whoever that is and saying, you know, this, this, and this are things that are good story ideas, and this is somebody that can, I'm kind of oversimplifying it here, but this is somebody that can speak to that. Would you like to talk to them? And a lot of times, if it makes sense, they're, you know, I mean, I, I've gotten, I've gotten some relationships with reporters and such that they know me well enough that they know that I'm not gonna bring somebody that's not a good fit, so they're gonna pay attention to who it is.
Robbie Harper (18:08):
And they'll tell me if they don't think it's the right fit or not. But a lot of times it's like, yeah, I mean, I'll, I'll see what they have to say. So, so it's, it's being very it's being very targeted and, and trying to build a relationship as much as you can with people in the media. But, you know, a lot of times, you know, in PR there they're, there's sort of some unwritten guidelines and stuff that, that we do. But, a lot of times that's somebody that I don't know, that's a reporter and editor that I've never connected with, but I've done the research to sit on on what they cover. And then I will bring this client to them, to their attention that, you know, I may not have a relationship with them, but if it's somebody that is definitely not a good fit that, you know, I should know better, then that's not a good way to build a relationship with a reporter because they're gonna, you know, block me and, and, and, you know, not, not, I'm not gonna be able to get out of the starting gate ever again.
Robbie Harper (19:18):
So, so there's a fine line, but that's what works it's just, it's, it's, it's getting in front of the right person with the right message. That's mutually beneficial to whoever's covering, whoever would be covering that, that person or individual or that content that they would be, they would be talking about.
Lee Murray (19:42):
Right. And, you know, we talked about strategy a little bit, but I, I think that in addition to the strategy that you bring to the table, I think it's also that network of journalists or reporters that you can call on in a moment's notice, cuz you're, as you mentioned, you're always constantly adding people to that list and there's a lot of value to the relationship that's there. I mean, hence the, the traditional word agency, right? I mean, that's really what you are, is that intermediary in a intermediary to the client and saying, you know, I may not know the right reporter or journalist, but I'll reach out and know how to handle that conversation. But a lot of times you will, you know, you'll have that connection. I think there's a lot of value in having, you know, pretty quick connection to, to a publication or, like a mainstream type of, outlet.
Lee Murray (20:33):
but you know, it makes me think too where we are today, even. I mean, that's why we're here, we're on a podcast, right? Like there's a lot of podcasters out there that are looking for guests, there's a lot of people out there that need to be, be on podcasts because they need to share their expertise in these niche, communities that exist on Spotify and overcast and apple podcast and other places is, is, is that something that you do for your clients is, is helping them, you know, navigate that podcasting world. Because to me, it seems like a very similar thing where you're building a network of podcasters, you know, are looking for these type of guests. Like you are a journalist, how do you approach that?
Robbie Harper (21:18):
So it's a little bit different, but the short answer is yes, that is a, you know, we're talking about niche audiences and podcasting is a medi now that, you know, unlike radio, which radio is just, you know, kind of literally broadcasting, the message mm-hmm, <affirmative> podcasting, it's, it's so narrow. And so, just the good thing about it is that you can find a podcast that, is the, you probably the right audience for you or for your, your company. And so, but it's a little bit different. It's a little bit different in a, an approach to somebody that's a podcaster like, so somebody like you, as opposed to, a journalist where I would approach a journalist a little more formal, there's a little bit more, in a way more formal, you know, when I, when I email a journalist, it's like, you know, there's kind of certain, there's certain vernacular that, you know, you kind of need to use or kind of at least know of a little bit.
Robbie Harper (22:32):
I mean, some journalists are gonna be forgiving if, you know, just an average business owner reaches out to them. I mean, they're, they'll know that, but, but somebody that's a podcaster, you know, they're usually just looking to fill content, they're looking to find somebody right. And, and you don't have to be like, you know, have this perfect pitch and this and that, it's a little more laid back in a lot of ways. And I think a lot of people in the PR world lose sight of that, that they try to formalize this pitch to, like they would to pitch to a reporter for the New York times or the wall street journal. And with podcasters, you don't have to do that. It's just, you know, Hey, I'm, you know, listen to a couple episodes, you know, do your homework and, and kind of look at and listen to the content that they're putting out and then reach out and just say, Hey, you know, I've got somebody, here's his website, here's his LinkedIn page. Here are some things that, you know, and somebody and somebody else can do this too. Like, you can do this on your own own. Yeah,
Lee Murray (23:46):
Right.
Robbie Harper (23:47):
, you just, you gotta know where to look, but I, I, you know, being in being a PR agency, I mean, we have tools and resources that make that a lot easier to where, whether it's podcasters, whether it's bloggers, whether it's, you know, traditional journalists, we have access to media databases that have a lot of that information that these databases comb through you know, not just the internet or newspapers or magazines, but also podcast links and that kind of thing. And, you know, there's, there's contact information. I will say when reaching out to podcasters, you know, most podcasts have a, if you go to the page, it kind of spells it out for you when you go to a certain podcast, like a homepage or whatever, it pretty much spells out what the podcast is about and, and the journey that they're on. So as long as you can bring somebody to the table, even if it's yourself, that can help that podcast or tell that story and explore that journey you're in, I mean, it, it's, it's, it's a done deal. , and so, that's right. It, but it it's in a lot of ways, it's easier for podcasters people just don't, people don't think about it, you know what I mean? It's like, but it's literally spelled out on their sites.
Lee Murray (25:22):
Yeah. So, okay. Then that's some practical advice right there as a business owner. Mm-hmm <affirmative>, if you want to do a little bit of your own PR you can just go to your favorite podcasters, and you know, maybe if they're in the millions of, you know, views or, or downloads, they won't pay attention to you, but you know, there's someone out there you never know. I mean, you never know who really needs more guests on their show, depending on how their show set up, reach out like Robbie saying, go look it up and say, Hey, I think I'd be a good guest. And here's why, mm-hmm <affirmative>, but it's, you know, putting the time in and sending those emails and, and reaching out to them and and doing that, that, that, you know, is where you're gonna get the results, just like it is with any marketing effort.
Lee Murray (26:10):
, you know, so you, right, you were talking about you know, them doing it themselves kind of as a sidebar. And I remember not too long ago, you, you posted, something maybe it was on your side or in LinkedIn or something where you talked about, if you wanna basically do this for yourself, here's how you do it, am I remembering that correctly? Or where, where can people find that? Yeah, so like, cause I'm thinking about that, that business artist, like, I just wanna know more about it, but I don't really wanna talk to anybody. I just wanna kind of see how this whole thing works, cuz I wanna explore it and maybe I'll try to do it on my own. And if I, you know, if it hits a roadblock, I'll hire somebody, but I thought that was great that you sort of just put the formula out there and let people see, you know, thes behind curtain.
Robbie Harper (27:01):
Yeah, that was an email I think I sent out, and I will post that on, I think it was on my personal website on Robbie, harper.com, R O B B I E H a R P E R, so I think that that particular post you're talking about, that that's, I will put that there. I mean, there's other on my company page, Bluebridge pr.com. There's a few things there, but, beyond that, I mean, there's some other places for DIY type stuff that, you know, kind of a behind the curtain one, there's one, one company called a website called spin sucks.com. okay. Which is funny. , but there's that, and I mean, there's some other ones, but yeah. I mean, you don't, you don't really have to look too far to find, that, and I think, you know, and you can always do something, like I said, but for like a targeted effort, you know, for, you know, somebody that is going to constantly on your behalf, like get in front of people, get in front of podcasters, bloggers, whomever, then I would, I mean, I'm not just saying this because it's what I do, but you know, any, anybody that has a good, you know, working with a marketing agency or a salesperson or whatever, you know, having somebody that focuses on that and does that really well, you're going to get so much farther, so much quicker that's right.
Robbie Harper (28:48):
, but you know, you can still do it and you can, you know, I've known people that have gotten you know, landed stuff in, in, on podcasts or, and in like the wall street journal, I mean, it, it happens right, another, another place is a, a popular place. There's a lot of competition on it, but, it's Harrow H a R O, which is help a reporter out, you can go up and you can sign up for, you know, listings and email listings and that kind of thing, where reporters are looking for somebody to speak to about a certain topic. So, a lot of times I've known people that have gotten their own stuff from that, so you know, it, it does happen, so you know, better, you know, you can start there and then, then, you know, hopefully hopefully a business will build up and then you can, you can look for an agency.
Lee Murray (29:49):
Yeah. That's great. And I've used, Harrow before. And, you know, I found that it became overwhelming. I think it's a great resource, but I, it became overwhelming because you get all these emails in your inbox and you're just not really sure, you know, which one do I respond to and how much time do I spend doing this? And, you know, I'm saying all these giving back all this feedback, and I'm not really sure where this is going, that kind of thing, so, yeah, I mean, I think it's a great resource, but, it can be overwhelming to say the least it's tough, you know? , yeah, I think it, I think really what comes down to is people have to have a, have to recognize the importance for it and then prioritize it. Right. Yeah, and I think a lot of the times it has to do with personal brand is a harder thing to understand why to do it, maybe in certain industries than it is for the company brand, and, appreciate that those resources, because I think that people always wanna have a place to go, you know, to look at stuff on your own when you're looking at, you know, growth for your business, where, where do you go for? Like, what resources do you call on? You have certain books that you recommend or podcasts you listen to?
Robbie Harper (31:03):
, yeah, I mean, as far as, as far as PR stuff, there's a guy who I follow his name is Michael smart. And, basically his audience is PR people, and, and it's, he has positioned himself as an expert among that group of people. And so, somebody that, you know, just, a normal business owner probably wouldn't want to go that far down the rabbit hole in the nuts and bolts of that level, because if he did you, you wouldn't have any time to do whatever it is that you do for your business. Yeah, but he, he is somebody that I've learned so much from, beyond that. , yeah, I mean, there's, in the PR stuff, I mean, there's the PRSA, the public relations society of America and there's some other PR level stuff, but, but beyond that, as far as just business things that I do, I mean, I'm a big follower of, Donald Miller who wrote a book called story brand where it's using the elements of story to, help, what he talks about is more of a marketing, side to it.
Robbie Harper (32:35):
But PR fits right into that as well. I mean, they go hand in hand in so many different ways, but it's about, you know, using communicating, using the elements of story that in messaging and, and is when I use it for, in PR that, you know, in stories and novels and movies, there's, you know, a few basic characters, there's a, there's a main character like a protagonist and a villain and a, and a, like a, a guide. And so what a lot of people do in, you know, their brand and their personal brand and their company brand is that they position themselves as the hero that is going to solve all their problems and do all these things, which is the wrong thing to do, instead you should position yourself as the guide, like the, like Yoda to Luke Skywalker who is going to, you know, tell him and give him the tools and the things to make him successful to, you know, defeat the death star and, you know, win the day.
Robbie Harper (33:45):
Yeah. So, that's been a huge thing, like a big thing in, in my business is just helping people to understand the message that they're putting out there. , whether it's marketing, whether it's PR, whether it's sales, that you're just there as somebody that's gonna bring some tools and kind of show them, teach them how to fish in a lot of ways. Right. Have the message be that, that they're the ones that's going to, be successful and that what you have to offer is going to, to land that client or convert that customer or whatever it is. So, yeah, that, that's huge. It's just, it, it's a huge perspective and was like one of the, like an aha moment for me and my business.
Lee Murray (34:33):
Yeah. That's great, as we're wrapping up here, what would be, if you could change the mind of a business owner about anything PR marketing, you know, anything that you would you've found in, in working with business owners that you think they need, they should change their mind about what would that be?
Robbie Harper (34:55):
Well, that's one of them, about perspective on, you know, your brand, whether you're, you're going to, whether you're going to kind of position yourself as an end, all be all or, or that guide type figure. That's definitely one of them, something else, that's a tough one, I still, you finally, you know, just, you did, I think just not, not having a one size fits all approach mm-hmm <affirmative> to business, and, and kind of taking, diving into the specifics, and, and, and really looking at something with unique and different eyes which that's what I do. , you know, I mean, I, I look at, I'm able to look at something from the outside in, when I work with clients. It's a little bit harder for you to do that with your own business. right. But, you know, looking, I mean, even me, you know, with things with my business that it's, it's like, there's, there's that outside perspective that is so important that, you know, you can't see the forest of the trees or whatever that saying is, it's like, right.
Robbie Harper (36:28):
You're in the middle of it day in and day out, and it's hard for you to see that, and that's why people hire, you know, that's why professional golfers have a golf coach, you know, that's why for that, that outside perspective, sure. And, and so, yeah, I mean, that's taking that approach with yourself, but with also your customers and clients that, you know, they're, they're paying you for a reason, and you, can't, it's hard to do a cookie cutter approach with, I mean, maybe some businesses you can, but, I find, I find that more than more often than not, that's, that's not the case.
Lee Murray (37:15):
Right. So before we go, where can people find you, if they wanna, they're looking for somebody to talk about PR, where do they go to find you
Robbie Harper (37:24):
Mm-hmm <affirmative>, Bluebridge pr.com blue bridge with a B , pr.com. A lot of people say blue Ridge kind of rolls off the tongue that way, but it's, it's a, it's a bridge funny. , I grew up in a small town that had a draw bridge and it was blue and that's just, you know, it was right outside the, my, there you go, my backyard. So it was just a simple, simple name, but yeah, blue bridge.com.
Lee Murray (37:56):
You spent a lot of time in the blue Ridge mountains too. So, I mean, there's, that,
Robbie Harper (38:00):
That's true. That that is true, you know, completely unrelated, but, unrelated. So there, you know, my web personal website, Robbie, harper.com, R O I E, so yeah, and I'm on LinkedIn, I'm on, Twitter, all the social places. So, so those are the best places to find me and interact. And if anybody has any questions or anything like that, I mean, I'm always always up for the discussion and, especially how, you know, how personal branding relates to and can help leverage somebody's business to make them successful
Lee Murray (38:48):
Most definitely. All right, Robbie, thanks for being on it's been a great conversation and I, I expect to fully have you back at some point to dive deeper, maybe we can do some use cases or something where we can dive into how, you know, specifically how you've used PR to for growth in a company and kind of pick it apart just to, just to get people an idea. I think of how they can think about it in their company. I think that'd be fun. Mm-hmm <affirmative>
Robbie Harper (39:16):
Yeah, that'd be great. Love to do it.
Lee Murray (39:19):
All right. Thank you. We'll talk to you soon. Hey, I really appreciate you tuning into this episode of exploring growth. I'm trying to get this in the hands of as many growing businesses as possible, so they can take this practical wisdom and deployed in their companies or with their teams. If you're getting some value out of this show and know someone who should listen as well, would you consider sharing with them or leave a positive review on the platform in which you're listening or watching YouTube audience leave a comment below with something you liked or your perspective on what we discussed? , I'm grateful for everyone that tunes in every week, let's keep exploring.